I’m loving reddit as a web community more than ever.
An apparent follower of the Bab, but not Baha’u’llah, came to the exBaha’i subreddit. I naturally suspected them of being an agent of Wahid Azal, sent like the others to disrupt our work.
So I decided to pull no punches, especially after another Bayani offered this newcomer a link to one of Azal’s own subreddits.
On the payroll of Iranian government?! You don’t think that’s a little extreme?
I had to switch to another web browser to see who and what you were responding to. I blocked you-know-who and others of his gang months ago, as I promised the moderators of this subreddit I would do.Of course his remarks are extreme, that’s what degenerate cults are known for! According to their ringleader, I am a racist promoting white supremacy, a Haifan Baha’i operative, a wife beater, and a con artist.Of course, none of those things are true…..but I guess if you seriously claim Islamic fundamentalists are in alliance with atheists, you would believe any other lie spouted by the fearless Bayani leader.
I don’t really have any connection to the Bab or Bahaullah. I was briefly active in the faith and did try to learn about them while I was active.
All the Baha’i-approved literature is watered down from what I remember. Much of the Bab’s writings are not out for public consumption Bahais sometimes claim the works remain untranslated. There isn’t much unbiased material about the Bab from Baha’i-approved sources, either. It’s hard to say who he was.
I don’t know, it seems kind of suspicious that they avoid talking about the Bab, and never recommend his literature. I haven’t gotten far in Ruhi– but to my knowledge there is more mention of Shoghi Effendi and Abdulbaha than the Bab (which is strange since the Bab is supposed to be a manifestation).
You’re right, he is not mentioned much at all.
They avoid discussing the Bab because from an objective standpoint, his ministry was a colossal failure. His followers actually tried to overthrow the Persian government, which only resulted in the Bab and thousands of his followers being killed, leaving the Babi community broken. It was Baha’u’llah who rebuilt that community, and most of the Babis recognized his superior leadership and chose to follow him, but in doing so they became Baha’is, members of a different religion. As a result, Baha’u’llah is considered a supreme Manifeststion of God and the Bab was reduced to merely his forerunner……but that was NOT what was intended by the Bab himself!
It would have been more logical to abandon the Bab’s legacy completely, but consistent logic doesn’t occur to cult members.
The Bab actually appointed Subh-i-Azal to succeed him. Baha’u’llah usurped his position and was about to kill him.
To me, that discredits the Bab. Baha’u’llah might never have usurped his brother’s leadership position if Subh-i-Azal been as capable a leader as the Bab or Baha’u’llah. Baha’is claiming that the appointment of Subh-i-Azal was only that of a temporary figurehead is simply after-the-fact damage control to hide that the Bab made such an obvious mistake. The apparent truth is that the Bab in his delusionary state fully expected to establish some sort of new theocracy and live to a ripe old age, so of course he would have appointed a younger man to be his successor, not an older one. The martyrdom of the Bab destroyed the credibility of Subh-i-Azal’s appointment.
Then a Baha’i drops by and makes things worse.
There are many reasons why people reject the claims of a relatively new or less known Messenger. How many people even know the story of Baha’ullah, His lineage (descendant of Abraham, Zoroasters and the Persian kings mentioned in the Hebrew Bible), His history, and His teachings? This failure of to recognize the Messengers and the Source of guidance has been a consistent theme and complaint in the Hebrew and Christian Bibles and in the Quran. It has been the theme of many religious texts that men have eyes but cannot see, ears but cannot hear, and hearts but cannot feel (variations on this can be found in the texts of all the major monotheistic faiths practiced at this time).
Most people are unaware of or unwilling to fully investigate the Writings and claims of the Baha’i Faith. The claims of Baha’u’llah are quite strong and difficult for many people to accept at face value without substantial effort investigating fully the matter and without an open mind to the possibilities. Few people are willing to fully investigate religion or religious matters in general. For persons that believe in God, most of the bases for rejection are out of fear of the unknown or change (including fear of the consequences economically, in one’s family, and to one’s reputation from changing one’s faith), ignorance of the reality and facts and the Message, and/or due to certain dogmatic beliefs or unrealistic expectations regarding the meaning of certain passages in their religious texts or certain misunderstandings of their faiths. There is a tendency for these reasons to simply dismiss out of hand anything that does not “fit” within a person’s existing understanding of reality and religion.
Pope Pius IX declared himself to be the Vicar of Christ on earth. Baha’u’llah told him that the Promised One Whom he awaited had come. The returned Christ was standing before his eyes.
Baha’u’llah warned the Pope not to reject Him because His Name was different than he expected:
“O Pope . . . Beware lest any name debar thee from God… Dwellest thou in palaces whilst He Who is the King of Revelation liveth in the most desolate of abodes? Leave them unto such as desire them, and set thy face with joy and delight toward the Kingdom . . . “
ENOUGH! I went after him.
I really hate self-righteous crap like that above!
I think one of the many reasons people do not embrace the Baha’i Faith is because their emotional and spiritual needs either do not fit in it or are perfectly satisfied by whatever religion they were raised in. I invented a concept called “spiritual orientation” to explain people’s different responses to religions and their dogmas and associated rituals.
We really need to quash this ridiculous notion that any particular faith, whether Christianity, Islam, the Baha’i Faith, or even atheism, is perfectly suited and appropriate for everyone in the world. That is the basis of bigotry and even atrocities like the Holocaust. “You won’t convert to MY religion, therefore you are not worthy of my respect!” Even the Quran teaches the opposite of that bullshit, in Sura 109:
[[[Say: O disbelievers! I worship not that which ye worship; Nor worship ye that which I worship. And I shall not worship that which ye worship. Nor will ye worship that which I worship. Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion.]]]
Now, GET OUT!
This must have had an effect on at least some of the viewers of the exBahai subreddit. A short time later, someone left this comment on my blog.